Are Dreams Messages from God?

Hello Ali, how are you?

I am a 16 year old agnostic who is very confused. I see all these “miracles” about Islam such as the number 19, scientific descriptions in the Qur’an, and so-on.

How should I go about this?

I also get very curious constantly an type in to Google keywords like “Qur’an miracle” or “proof Qur’an is from God.”

I don’t know what sparks the curiosity, but it certainly has gotten me very confused and sad.

Thank you

These things also tripped me up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wuFFX3M0oY

 

dream1

Dear Lewis.

There is nothing wrong in being confused, as long as you are curious and curiosity is a great virtue. You should worry when your mind becomes trapped in conviction and faith.  Since truth is infinite, the search for truth is a never ending journey.  You can never reach infinity.

As for miracles in the Quran, there are none. Muslims have come up with hundreds of miracles that they say prove the Quran is from God. They are wrong on both accounts. Firstly, their so called miracles are self-deceptions and products of false interpretations. Secondly, even if there were strange things in the Quran, they do not prove that this book is from God. It would prove that it is from Satan.  Assuming Satan wanted to deceive people, what better way would he have than to produce a few tricks to fool the gullible?

Jesus warned his disciples, “For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect” (Matt. 24:24). He repeated this warning in Matt. 24:11 “And many false prophets will appear and deceive many people.” He must have thought this is important, so he reiterated again, ““Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.” (Mtt. 7:15)

If I claim to be a physician and you ask for proof, can I produce a rabbit out of my hat as proof? Of course not! The proof that I am a doctor is in whether I can cure people.  So how can we know if someone claiming to be a prophet is telling the truth?  Jesus said,   “By their fruit you will recognize them.”(Matt. 7:16)

By their fruits! This is the only criterion he gave and one does not have to believe in Jesus, because this is the only criterion that makes sense.  He did not say look at their miracles because he knew people can come with all sorts of tricks and deceive even the elect and he was right.

So, miracles can be either tricks or the work of Satan.  In the case of Muhammad, it was neither because he performed no miracles.  I have written an article titled “Did Muhammad Perform Miracles?” where I quote the Quran to show he confessed he could not do miracles.  He claimed that the Quran is his only miracle. But there is no miracle in the Quran. That book is full of errors and absurdities. One friend of mine has found over 1000 mistakes in the Quran.  1000mistakes.com   This is a massive site written for serious researchers. If you want a short list of the errors in the Quran, I have them here.

In this article, I have gone through all the claims that Zakir Naik makes to prove the Quran is miraculous and refuted them all. I published this article nine years ago and sent the link to Dr. Naik inviting him to respond.  I am still waiting, but not holding my breath. No other Muslim came to defend his silly arguments either.  I am offering $50,000 to any Muslim who can prove Islam is true.  It is 11 years now and no takers.

If the only criterion to recognize a prophet is by their fruit, let us look at the fruits of Muhammad. He raided villages and towns, butchered unarmed men and took as slaves their wives and children. He then sold those hapless captives and raped the prettier girls among them.  He told his followers to do the same.  This is just a token of this man’s crimes. How can such a person be a prophet of God?

Then look at the actions of Muslims. Since 9/11 that the site thereligionofpeace.com is keeping records, there have been on average 4.5 terrorist attacks every day, all perpetrated by Muslims.  The victims of these crimes are hundreds of thousands.  But the total victims of Islam, since the time of Muhammad, exceed 280 million and this does not include Muslims who were killed in the hands of other Muslims in sectarian fights. This is the fruit of Islam. You shall know them by their fruit not by their tricks.

As for the numerical miracles in the Quran, this too is a deception.  The articles posted in this site answering-islam.org/Quran/Numerics/  prove these claims are trickeries.

You must have seen magicians at work. They make extraordinary things and can really leave you dumbfounded. But they are honest to tell you it is all tricks.  Muslims perform similar tricks with words and concepts. They can impress those who don’t know how these tricks work, but I have exposed all the tricks of Zakir Naik who is the best trickster Muslims have.  I hope you find time to read this article and see how he performs his tricks. Once you know, you too will become an expert and will be able to expose Islamic trickery.

As for the video of this benighted person who thinks he saw seven heavens in his dream and since Muhammad spoke of seven heavens then Islam must be true, I have written an article on this subject, titled The Seven Layers of Heaven  where I have shown that the concept of seven heavens predates Islam and has its root in paganism. Muhammad rehashed what he had heard.  So if heavens are seven, it is a miracle of Pagans not of Muhammad who just plagiarized from them.

He argues that if someone like Hitler repents one minute before his death it would not be fair that he go to the same heaven that  good people go.  This only shows his ignorance of heaven.  Heaven is not like what Catholics and Muslims believe.  I have written an article on this subject titled, Should We Fear God?  I explained why it is not consistent with the nature of God to punish people, but why all our actions and thoughts in this world will boomerang back to us and we will experience what we have done to others in our own soul.  So Hitler has to feel the pains of millions of his victims before he is redeemed and Muhammad has to experience the suffering of billions of his victims before his redemption. God will not judge nor does he punish anyone. But there are laws in the other world just as there are laws in this world.  In the next world we will live the experiences of those who we come in contact in this world. If we show kindness to others, we will experience that kindness and if we are cruel to them we will feel that cruelty. There is no judgement and there is no punishment.  We just relive our life and the lives of people whom we interact with in this world.  So if you make someone happy you will feel that happiness, in exact same proportion. If you hurt someone, you will feel that hurt. If you hurt millions, you have to feel all that pain and suffering.  This law will take care of the justice without God judging anyone or punishing anyone and there is no need to build layers in heaven and hell.  Everyone will go to the same place, feeling differently, just as in this world everyone lives on the same planet, while some are happy and others are miserable.

Using the same logic of this man who says it is unjust that all the believers go to the same place because their sins are of different magnitude, why then have only seven levels?  Let us say someone kills one person and repents. As a believer he will go to heaven but as a killer he will stay in the lower heaven.  But what about a serial killer who repents before his death?  Will he also go to the same lower level of heaven?   Wouldn’t that be injustice? And what about someone like Hitler?  Assuming he repents, will he also go to the same lower heaven?  I hope you see the absurdity of this man’s logic about the necessity of heaven having seven layers.  Since no two person’s sins are equal, for God to be just he should have a heaven of infinite layers.

The truth is that there are no layers in heaven. But souls will have ranks.

Now, you say, but how do you know this if you haven’t been there?  I haven’t been there but countless others have and they all tell the same story.  Here is the story of a couple of them. I invite everyone to watch them.

Continues… Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5, Part 6

Continues… Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, Part 5

Continue to Part 2

 

There are more on Youtube.   What these people say is nothing like what Muhammad said.  The claims of Muhammad make no sense. If you believe in him you must believe that God is a cruel and a stupid fellow. On the other hand the stories of the people with near death experience make sense. That is the kind of afterlife I have no difficulty accepting.  I accept that not only because it makes sense it is also compatible with the newest discoveries in science. I am working on an article that will address that topic.

Scientists are telling us that information is not lost. We are information.  Everything can be broken down into bits. Every action and every thought that we have is indestructible.  What happens to this information when we die?  If it is indestructible where does it go?  Those who experienced death and came back tell us a story that, not only is remarkable, it is also irrefutable.

The NDE is not a hallucination.  Some of these people saw and heard their doctors and their relatives in the waiting room when they were completely unconscious in the operation room. They then reported what they saw and heard.  This puzzled their doctors.  They could not possible have seen or heard those things while they were unconscious and specially things that happened in other rooms. Try to explain this story through materialistic lens.

 

The concepts of an orgiastic heaven full of virgins for Muslim terrorists to bang and a hell made of fire for Mother Theresa and other non-Muslims, as described by Muhammad, is asinine.  It is clear that he was an impostor and a liar. He was utterly ignorant of the spiritual realm. I will write more on that in future, but for now you can read this article. Why Muhammad Loves Me Most? where I briefly touch the subject.

dreams

If the dream of this man hearing lalalala is evidence that for the truth of Islam then the dream of all these Muslims seeing Jesus must also be evident that Islam is false.  Unlike him, they did not hear just lalalala. They met Jesus who came to them and talked to them leaving no room for interpretation and guess work.

Dreams are not messages from the other world. They are messages from our subconscious mind.  It is possible to dream our own future thoughts, feelings and events. This should not be taken as evidence that such dreams have been sent by God.  We can even dream the thoughts of others. When I was a student in Italy, I met a girl on the street doing missionary work, who invited me to visit their church. I couldn’t understand Italian yet and sat there daydreaming.  I saw the devotion of these people and my mind wandered thinking if someone entered the church forcing them, under the point of gun, to recant, will they recant to save their lives or will they give their lives for their faith.  This was just a passing silly thought.  We get millions of them every day.  When I returned home, the woman from whom I had rented a room told me that the night before she had a dream seeing me entering a church and with a gunpoint forcing the believers to recant.  She had dreamed my thoughts before I had them.   How that was possible?  Coincidence!? Not so!  Quantum physics is beginning to find the answer to these puzzles.

We don’t understand dreams.  If we can even dream the thoughts of others, then it is foolish to rely on dream as evidence of truth.  And if you watch the videos I provided in this article, you will see that those who have had NDE say they could see the thoughts of other souls and the thought of living people.

Muhammad was a false prophet because of his poisonous fruits. That is the only infallible criterion we should use.  Dreams and alleged miracles are not the correct criteria. They can be very misleading because it is easy for charlatans to conjure them. But you can’t be fooled by looking at the fruits of someone claiming to be a prophet.

God is love. The message of Muhammad is the message of hate. How God can send a message so evil to mankind?

 

Jul 28, 2013

Lewis replied with the following email

 I read it! I have another question, though.. I’m not sure if there’s something wrong with me or what, but I get overly curious and look up things. It’s to the point where I can’t do anything else until I look stuff up. It’s very irritating. Do you have any idea what this might be?

p.s. this seemed convincing http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=pcmpI1gsOkI

im very confused

 

In my response to you, I asked you to read my refutation of all Zakir Naik’s claims that the Quran contains miracles. http://www.faithfreedom.org/debates/NaikCampbellintro.htm

In this long article I refute all 30 claims of Naik with ample evidence.   Had you read that you’d have realized that Muslims lie to prove their religion.  They lie to themselves first because they are so convinced that they want those lies to be true.  They lie to others because they think they are doing them a service by converting them to Islam.   Lying is an integral part of Islamic da’wa. It is an unspoken rule that is subliminally taught to every Muslim child and convert.

Take the example of the seven layers of heaven that you brought up.  In my article I quoted Adnan Okhtai a.k.a Haroun Yahya who claims these 7 layers are physical layers of the atmosphere http://alisina.org/blog/2010/11/11/layers-of-heaven/  I showed he is wrong.  This convert in your video says they are seven layers of the invisible heaven and hell. He bases his claim on his dream.  Is this a scientific way to establish a fact?   I also showed why it is illogical for God to have just seven layers of heaven and hell. Even the human justice that does not claim to be infallible is fairer.  The ranges of penalties we have for criminals and offenders are extremely diverse. We don’t lump them in just seven categories.  This idea that there are seven heavens and seven hells is stupid. It is up to you to decide whether the dreams of this man are false dreams or God is unfair and stupid.  Which makes more sense to you?

Now that we have evidence that Muslims lie and they think it is a virtue to lie to make Islam dominant how much credence should we give to the claim that Muslims make about the water of Zamzam? What is the chance that they lie also in this case? Has any independent and reliable non-Muslim university or lab confirmed this claim?

The claim that the Zamzam water has good energy is not proven. Had it been true, Muslims who love to impress the world about the miraculous nature of their religion would have sent it to a lab (not influenced by Muslims) to analyze it independently and publish the result in a scientific journal. This would have given their religion a major boost. But they won’t do that because they know they are lying. Zamzam water has been tested and it is found to be extremely contaminated. Its sale is illegal in UK. It contains dangerous levels of arsenic. It does not heal you; it can make you seriously ill.  http://www.adweek.com/adfreak/holy-water-mecca-marketed-illegally-uk-131396

Watch this video for the truth about Zamzam water.

Now let us assume that these bogus claims about miracles were true. What is the criterion of a true prophet?  Shouldn’t we look at their fruits?  How can a mass murderer, a rapist, a thief, a torturer, a pedophile, and an assassin be a prophet of God?

The matter is clear. If anyone seeks the truth all he has to do is look at the despicable life of Muhammad, his teachings of hate and violence and the deplorable, backwardness misery, and savagery of his followers to realize we are dealing with a demonic creed.

You ask why you are intrigued by Islam.  Muhammad was the most evil man ever born.  Why instead of looking at his fruits you are mesmerized by these bogus claims and lies about his alleged miracles?  This is a question only you should answer. Why reason, facts and truth have little impact on you and you are fascinated by patent lies? How is it that Muhammad’s despicable crimes don’t affect you and these baseless  deceptions impress you?   How can I answer these questions? Assuming these claims were true, they still don’t prove Muhammad was a prophet of God. “You will recognize them by their fruits.” They can “perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect.” The truth is that no such signs exist and they are all leis make your fascination with them even less explainable.

God has created all sorts of people, just as he created all sorts of creatures. Bees are attracted to flowers and flies are attracted to excrement.  There are people who are naturally drawn to evil.  So don’t be too harsh on yourself. Maybe God created you in this way. Addicts are drawn to drug. Criminals are drawn to crime. It maybe your nature that you are drawn to lies. No good human finds Islam attractive. The converts to Islam can be classified in two groups: evil people and foolish people.  The foolish people eventually come to their senses and all of them admit that their conversion to Islam was the most stupid decision of their life. The evil people love Islam . They find in Islam a religion that approves of their desire to hate and to kill and even promises them sexual rewards.

And I agree that you are very confused.  I am afraid your confusion is deliberate.

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733 Responses

  1. hilde says:

    Dear Ali Sina,

    I am a non-Muslim woman raised as a christian, but even in christianity ( the church) I saw a lot of hypocrisy. Anyway I love the figure of Jesus

    and I , like you, believe that christians not always follow his words. I worked a lot in Indonesia and was there also after the Bali Bombing. I speak the language and followed the news on tv. I was surprised by some commentaries that these terrorists were following the exact orders of their prophet. So I read the Koran, the Hadiths and the live of the prophet. And I was chocked by the lack of justice in these writing. The open hatred and violence towards the Jews and all other Muslims. So I read it again and again and became more chocked. This is 11 or 12 years ago. So I could not hide my chock and started talking about it with my friends. But surprise! They said I was a racist and islamophobe and that not all Muslims were terrorists. I had a hard time and felt really bad about it. So I read it again, but couldn't find it anything different then a false prophecy just told by the prophet to establish his power and let everybody do it his way. It was so abvious, transparant and almost ridiculous. Anyway I kept my mouth shut for a long time, but in my country the criminality by Muslims youngsters grew, they asked all kind of privileges and of course now we have thousands of Muslims fighting in Syria and Iraq and now here in Europe they are afraid they will come back and do terrorists acts. But still the politic correctness (press, prominents and politicians) almost forces people to say that this has nothing to do with islam, because islam is peaceful and tolerant. It sometimes drives me crazy. I have a business and don't want to profile myself as a racist or islamophobe, but still open my mouth sometimes about it. My best friend is married to a Muslim, he is a very nice guy, but she takes very good care of him and they don't have children. What I want to ask you is: do you have some tips for me how to handle this, because I feel sometimes quite frustrated by this. I admire your strength and inteligence and als your empathy towards Muslims even though you see their religion is false. Thanks

  2. Mazzy Ali says:

    @Lewis

    If you're thinking Islam may be right, then search about Islam from an anti-Islam website. Trust me. It'll help. Don't be on a random hate-filled page to find out about Islam.

    May Allah guide you. :)

    & if any waste man feels the need to reply to this, or swear etc etc, don't bother because I'm not going to reply.

  3. narcole1919721 says:

    Ali, lewis asked how are you? im worried. you dont seem well..may i visit you? :'/ ill bring soup

  4. shabeer_hassan says:

    #there is no need to build layers in heaven and hell.  Everyone will go to the same place,……………………..BEST OF LUCK ………..MY DEAR BROTH/SIST SINNA SAY THERE IS NO PUNISHMENT ALL THE PEOPLE GOING THE SAME PLACE,I DON'T KNOW WHERE IS IT WAS [THAKS GOD FROM MUSLIM TEACHING HE WAS LEARN THERE IS PLACE PEOPLE GOINGTO AFTER THEIR DEATH] CONSIDER TWO WORKER THEIR BOSS GIVEN THEM TO SOME WORK & ADVICE THEM DO IT OR I WILL PUNISH U ,MR.A DID IT PERFECT WAY ,MR.B NEVER DID AT LEAST A SINGLE……….THERE THREE POSSIBILITIES OF WAGES 
    1) WAGES ONLY MR.A  & PUNISHMENT MR.B
    2)WAGES EQUALLY BOTH MR.A & B
    3) NO WAGES TO BOTH MR.A & B ,BUT PUNISHMENT
    WHAT IS AN IDEAL/TRUSTFUL WAY OF JUSTICE?
    #On the other hand the stories of the people with near death experience make sense…………THEY R NOT DEATH….THEY LIVING ……HOW CAN DEATH EXPERIENCE HAPPENED TO THEM?,PLZ USE COMMON SENSE …….. 

  5. shabeer_hassan says:

    #why it is not consistent with the nature of God to punish people……………..god punish the people who deviate the path of his nature/he was the creator of all ,he has the right to punish his creation , his Justice being trustful /moral ……….HITLER KILLED 6 M PEOPLE,HOW MANY TIME WE PUNISH HIM?LIKE FROM THE MANKIND HISTORY LOT OF BLOODSHED ,UN JUSTICE,MASSACRE HAPPENED. HOW MANY DROP OF BLOOD ? HOW MANY DROP OF TEARS? DOES ALL WHO PUNISHED OR EQUALLY PUNISHED? HOW MANY INJUSTICE GOING ON OUR WORLD PER SECOND, A DAY REQUIRED TO PUNISH ALL THE SINNER WITH WHAT THEY DID HERE ,ITS THE DREAM OF JUSTER ,ITS THE DREAM OF THE JUST WHO KEEP RIGHTEOUS,MORALS & GOOD MANNERS………. THE JUDGMENT COMPLETED/MORAL/IDEAL IT JUDGE WHO KNOW THE INTENTION OF THE PEOPLE /DEPTH OF THE CRIME & READ THE PEOPLE MIND[SOUL]………………………..
    #God will not judge nor does he punish anyone………………….PROOF????? JUST A CREATED HUMAN CLAIM,HAS LIMITATION WITH SOUND ,EAR,BRAIN,NOTHING TO CREATED HERE A SINGLE ATOM,NOTHING TO CONTROL HERE A SINGLE CELL,DEPENDING WATER,OXYGEN,FOOD,HEAT,& ETC ,DEPENDING ALL FROM GOD,TALKING /CRITICIZING MY ALMIGHTY GOD NATURE WITH THEIR 60-100 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE ,A LITTLE HUMAN BRAIN,THEY DON'T KNOW THE CAPACITY OF UNIVERSES ,WHO R THEY? 
    #Dreams are not messages from the other world. They are messages from our subconscious mind………………………………….
    Muslim :: Book 29 : Hadith 5621 
    dreams are of three types: one good dream which is a sort of good tidings from Allah; the evil dream which causes pain is from the satan; and the third one is a suggestion of one's own mind; so if any one of you sees a dream which he does not like he should stand tip and offer prayer and he should not relate it to people, and he said: I would love to see fetters (in the dream), but I dislike wearing of necklace, for the fetters is (an indication of) one's steadfastness in religion. The narrator said: I do not know whether this is a part of the hadith or the words of Ibn Sirin.
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 87 :: Hadith 144 
    'There are three types of dreams: The reflection of one's thoughts and experiences one has during wakefulness, what is suggested by Satan to frighten the dreamer, or glad tidings from Allah. So, if someone has a dream which he dislikes, he should not tell it to others, but get up and offer a prayer." He added, "He (Abu Huraira) hated to see a Ghul (i.e., iron collar around his neck in a dream) and people liked to see fetters (on their feet in a dream). The fetters on the feet symbolizes one's constant and firm adherence to religion." And Abu 'Abdullah said, "Ghuls (iron collars) are used only for necks." 

  6. shabeer_hassan says:

    #4.5 terrorist attacks every day, all perpetrated by Muslims……………..
    Islam is without doubt the best religion but the media is in the hands of the
    westerners who are afraid of Islam. The media is continuously broadcasting
    and printing information against Islam. They either provide misinformation
    about Islam, misquote Islam or project a point out of proportion, if any.
    b. When any bomb blasts take place anywhere, the first people to be accused
    without proof are invariably the Muslims. This appears as headlines in the
    news. Later, when they find that non-Muslims were responsible, it appears
    as an insignificant news’ item.
    c. If a 50 year old Muslim marries a 15 year old girl after taking her permission, it
    appears on the front page but when a 50 year old non-Muslim rapes a 6 year
    old girl, it may appear in the news in the inside pages as ‘Newsbriefs’. Everyday
    in America on an average 2,713 cases of rape take place but it doesn’t appear
    in the news, since it has become a way of life for the Americans.
    2. Black sheep in every community:
    I am aware that there are some Muslims who are dishonest, unreliable, who
    cheat, etc. but the media projects this as though only Muslims are involved in
    such activities. There are black sheep in every community. I know Muslims who
    are alcoholics and who can drink most of the non-Muslims under the table.
    3. Muslims best as a whole:
    Inspite of all the black sheep in the Muslim community, Muslims taken on the
    whole, yet form the best community in the world. We are the biggest community
    of tee-totallers as a whole, i.e. those who don’t imbibe alcohol. Collectively, we
    are a community which gives the maximum charity in the world. There is no
    community as a whole in the world which can show even a candle to the
    Muslims where modesty is concerned; where sobriety is concerned; where
    human values and ethics are concerned.
    4. Don’t judge a car by its driver:
    If you want to judge how good is the latest model of the “Mercedes” car and a
    person who does not know how to drive sits at the steering wheel and bangs up
    the car, who will you blame? The car or the driver? But naturally, the driver. To
    analyze how good the car is, a person should not look at the driver but see the
    ability and features of the car. How fast is it, what is its average fuel
    consumption, what are the safety measures, etc. Even if I agree for the sake of
    argument that the Muslims are bad, we can’t judge Islam by its followers? If you
    want to judge how good Islam is then judge it according to its authentic sources,
    i.e. the Glorious Qur’an and the Sahih Hadith.
    5. Judge Islam by its best follower i.e. Prophet Mohammed (pbuh):
    If you practically want to check how good a car is put an expert driver behind the
    steering wheel. Similarly the best and the most exemplary follower of Islam by
    whom you can check how good Islam is, is the last and final messenger of God,
    Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Besides Muslims, there are several honest and
    unbiased non-Muslim historians who have acclaimed that prophet Muhammad
    was the best human being. According to Michael H. Hart who wrote the book,
    ‘The Hundred Most Influential Men in History’, the topmost position, i.e. the
    number one position goes to the beloved prophet of Islam, Muhammad (pbuh).
    There are several such examples of non-Muslims paying great tributes to the
    prophet, like Thomas Carlyle, La-Martine, etc.

  7. shabeer_hassan says:

    People who take weapons for fight prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 88 :: Hadith 190 ,91,92
    Prohibit killing with unjust:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 92 :: Hadith 423
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 37
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 17 
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 2,3,6,9
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 82 :: Hadith 840
    Bloodshed completely prohibited:
     Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 4,7 ,8
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 93 :: Hadith 611,23 
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 12
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 10 , 21
    People blood & properties, were honors and protected/sacred like Mecca:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 88 :: Hadith 199
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 81 :: Hadith 776 
    Forbid burning human:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 84 :: Hadith 57 
    quarrel/fight prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 3 :: Volume 43 :: Hadith 637 
    does not shed unlawful blood:
    Dawud :: Book 35 : Hadith 4257 , 59
    Help oppressed people & stop oppression
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 85 :: Hadith 84
    Taking self action prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 82 :: Hadith 829
    Revenge is prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 82 :: Hadith 836 
    prohibit women killing:
    Bukhari 4.52.256
    [killing girl prohibit]
    women killing prohibited:
    Malik :: Book 21 : Hadith 21.3.9 
    Dawud :: Book 41 : Hadith 5128,28
    prohibited killing when people who pray. 
    Dawud :: Book 41 : Hadith 4910 
    forbid killing animal
    Dawud :: Book 41 : Hadith 5247, 49 
    cut tree prohibit:
    Dawud :: Book 41 : Hadith 5220
    children captive killing prohibited:
    Dawud :: Book 38 : Hadith 4390 
    mischief through the land prohibited:
    Dawud :: Book 38 : Hadith 4357 ,59
    Provacation people to sin is prohibited:
    Dawud :: Book 12 : Hadith 2170 
    prophet family has no right to sadhaka & zakath:
    Dawud :: Book 19 : Hadith 2969 ,66,76,79
    prophet never consume other person property
    Dawud :: Book 22 : Hadith 3326 
    Punishment for killer either kill, or blood money to relative:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 19,20
    Fithna: protection of his family, his property, his children and his neighbors
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 88 :: Hadith 216 
    Fighting for physical earning prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 88 :: Hadith 228
    Being patience:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 268
    Public people have no right to punish the people:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 279
    Do not long for meeting your enemy
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 90 :: Hadith 343 
    mischief through the land prohibited:
    Dawud :: Book 38 : Hadith 4357 
    Dawud :: Book 38 : Hadith 4359
    Jew never killed without evidence:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 302 
    Making quarrel/fight between people prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 298
    Fighting each other prohibited: money punishment
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 30 
    children captive killing prohibited:
    Dawud :: Book 38 : Hadith 4390 
    Killing children Prohibited
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 92 :: Hadith 395 
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 1
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 82 :: Hadith 802
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 76 :: Hadith 480
    Physical earning, worldly benefit not expected:
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 76 :: Hadith 438 ,39
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 76 :: Hadith 455
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 76 :: Hadith 500 
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 76 :: Hadith 444,45,46,47,49
    Death punishment for killers: Qisas (i.e. equality in punishment)
    Bukhari :: Book 6 :: Volume 60 :: Hadith 25
     suicide attack prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 77 :: Hadith 603 , 604
    Slave sex prohibited:
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 79 :: Hadith 706
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 77 :: Hadith 600
    Forbid slave as gift:
    Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 80 :: Hadith 748,49,50, 51
    forced sex with slave prohibited:
    Bukhari:6949
    slave forced sex prohibited:
    Dawud :: Book 12 : Hadith 2304 
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 93 :: Hadith 506
    "Allah's Apostle prohibited taking money for blood, the price of a dog, and the earnings of a slave-girl by prostitution;
    Bukhari :: Book 3 :: Volume 34 :: Hadith 440 
    Bukhari :: Book 3 :: Volume 36 :: Hadith 483 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Wow

    • cchuckc says:

      @Shabeer,
      Here catching your lies:
      You say: //People who take weapons for fight prohibited: 
      Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 88 :: Hadith 190 ,91,92 //
      Lets see what these hadiths are really saying:

      Volume 9, Book 88, Number 190: Narrated: The statement of the Prophet: Whoever takes up arms against us, is not from us."

      Is this a prohibition? It is saying that if you attack us then you don't belong to us.

      //Prohibit killing with unjust: //
      Lets check the hadith again:
      Volume 9, Book 92, Number 423: Narrated 'Abdullah: The Prophet said, "None is killed unjustly, but the first son of Adam will have a part of its burden." 
      Sufyan said, "..a part of its blood because he was the first to establish the tradition of murdering"

      This is how Mhhammad is justifying the killings he did/ordered. To him, as indeed to every true muslim, not being muslim is a crime and punishable by death. That is ENOUGH justification, hence in Islamic logic, killing a polytheist is never unjustified.

      You say: //Bloodshed completely prohibited: 
       Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 4,7 ,8 
      Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 93 :: Hadith 611,23//
      Lets look at one of these:
      Volume 9, Book 93, Number 611: Narrated 'Abdullah:
      I asked Allah's Apostle "What is the biggest sin in the sight of Allah?" He said, "To set up rivals unto
      Allah though He alone created you." I said, "In fact, that is a tremendous sin," and added, "What
      next?" He said, "To kill your son being afraid that he may share your food with you." I further asked,
      "What next?" He said, "To commit illegal sexual intercourse with the wife of your neighbor."

      Where is general bloodshed prohibited in the above hadith? What is prohibited here is a father killing his son (but not daughter , mind you), polytheism and illegal sexual intercourse (This person could hardly say a thing without mentioning illegal sex).

      See Shabeer you are just a liar, and a very poor one at that.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Arabic pwease

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721,
      //Arabic pwease//
      On this site most people understand English. If you think these translations are wrong, point out where they are wrong. Otherwise zip up.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      But Islam prophet quran and hadiths use arabic. If you dont understand arabic in islam eat the biscuits 

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721,
      //But Islam prophet quran and hadiths use arabic.//
      If Islamic prophet and Allah had/have language deficiencies I can hardly help:-).
      But that is beside the point. Do you think the above translations are wrong? Yes, No? If No why are you complaining. If Yes, tell us what are the wrong parts and give us the correct English meanings since thats what 90% of people who visit here understand. If you are unable to do that simply shut up.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Okay, after you finish eating my biscuits :)

    • sakat_1408_123 says:

      If Allah had send the holly Book Quran for all human being, it should be readable by every human being in his own language.In some mythology the God sends the holy book to the human being .Where in any body opens it ,to him it appears in his own language ,even blind opens it he will automatically get divine eyes to read it .Even an illiterate opens it ,to him it will appear in the form of picture or an audio format.If an human consider Gods book in such manner in his mythology ,then why Quran cant do that miracle to establish its authenticity as divine book ha ha ha tell this cock and bull story to your illiterate brothers and sister they will give you prize .

    • narcole1919721 says:

      If you see nature, you will find quran. the sky moon stars cloud sun sea earth are telling in language for all. Ali Imran 190-191 : Indeed, in the creation of the sky and the earth and the alternation of the night and the day are signs for those of understanding. Who remember Allah while standing or sitting or [lying] on their sides and give thought to the creation of the heavens and the earth, [saying], "Our Lord, You did not create this aimlessly; exalted are You [above such a thing]; then protect us from the punishment of the Fire.

    • sakat_1408_123 says:

      How can blind will see his surroundings and deaf can hear the nature ha ha ha.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Using soul :)

    • shabeer_hassan says:

      @chuch………….FIRST MY SON GO TO SCHOOL AGAIN & LEARN THE KNOWLEDGE………..HOW CAN A MAN UNDERSTAND FROM THE SENTENCE "Whoever takes up arms against us, is not from us" ,TAKING ARMS FOR THE FIGHTING IS PROHIBITED ,THEY R NOT PART OF US[MUSLIM COMMUNITY]

      The Prophet said, "None is killed unjustly, but the first son of Adam will have a part of its burden." Sufyan said, "..a part of its blood because he was the first to establish the tradition of murdering" WHAT THE MEANING WAS IT ? KILLING UNJUST IS PROHIBITED,EVERY MURDERING A PART OF SHARE GOING TO ITS BEGINNER ,IE FIRST SON OF ADAM [A],HE BEGGING THE MURDERING HIS OWN BROTHER FOR A WOMEN  ,I DON'T KNOW CHUCK A BRAIN DEAD PERSON OR LUNATIC OR NOT ………. THE TIME REACHED TO CHANGE HIS CORNEA/LENSES FROM HIS EYE OR SOMEONE TEACH HIM TO BASIC ENGLISH LANGUAGE  OR ITS A RIGHT TIME ADMIT HIM TO MENTAL HOSPITAL FOR SHOCK TREATMENT……………………

       killing a polytheist is never unjustified. 
      Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 37 
      Allah's Apostle never killed anyone except in one of the following three situations: (1) A person[HERE NEVER SPECIFY WHETHER THEY R MUSLIM OR NON MUSLIM] who killed somebody [COMMON USAGE MUSLIM/NON MUSLIM]unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,)

      SUPPOSE WE CONSIDER THAT IF PROPHET INTENDED ALLOW KILLING NON MUSLIM BY MUSLIM ,THE HADITH NOT REVILED LIKE A NON MUSLIM who killed MUSLIM unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,) 

       #Where is general bloodshed………..1) READ ALL HADITH THAT I POSTED …………2)I ASKING U ONE QUESTION IS KILLING OWN SON WITH UNJUST IS BLOODSHED? OR MILKSHEAD? OR  WATERSHEAD? H2SO4SHEAD?
      #but not daughter'
      TAKE A NOTE BOOK WRITE THE FOLLOWING HADITH 1000000[EACH] TIME ,U EVER & NEVER SAYS ISLAM PROMOTING KILLING CHILDREN UP TO U'R DEATH: 
      Dawud :: Book 28 : Hadith 3872 
      Narrated Asma', daughter of Yazid ibn as-Sakan,: 
      I heard the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) as saying: Do not kill your children secretly, for the milk, with which a child is suckled while his mother is pregnant, overtakes the horseman and throws him from his horse. 
      Bukhari :: Book 5 :: Volume 58 :: Hadith 169 
      Narrated Asma bint Abi Bakr: I saw Zaid bin Amr bin Nufail standing with his back against the Ka'ba and saying, "O people of Quraish! By Allah, none amongst you is on the religion of Abraham except me." He used to preserve the lives of little girls: If somebody wanted to kill his daughter he would say to him, "Do not kill her for I will feed her on your behalf." So he would take her, and when she grew up nicely, he would say to her father, "Now if you want her, I will give her to you, and if you wish, I will feed her on your behalf." 
      Saheeh Bukhari
      Volume 004, Book 052, Hadith Number 258.
      Narrated By Ibn 'Umar : During some of the Ghazawat of Allah's Apostle a woman was found killed, so Allah's Apostle forbade the killing of women and children. 
      Saheeh Muslim
      Book 019, Hadith Number 4320
      It is narrated by Ibn 'Umar that a woman was found killed in one of these battles; so the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) forbade the killing of women and children.
      arrated Anas ibn Malik: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Go in Allah's name, trusting in Allah, and adhering to the religion of Allah's Apostle. Do not kill a decrepit old man, o a young infant, or a child, or a woman; do not be dishonest about booty, but collect your spoils, do right and act well, for Allah loves those who do well.  (Sunan Abu Dawud , Book 14, Number 2608)
      WHO KILLED CHILDREN:
      1 Samuel 15:2-3
      2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt. 
      3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
       2 Chronicles 15:13
       All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman.
      2 Kings 2:23-24
      Then two she-bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys. (NRSV)  
      Deuteronomy 2:32-34
      we took all his cities at that time, and utterly destroyed every inhabited city, with the women and the little ones; we left none remaining. (ASV)
      1 Samuel 15:3,8
      Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.' " … He took Agag king of the Amalekites alive, and all his people he totally destroyed with the sword.(NIV)
      PLZ ADVICE THEM ………………………..

    • cchuckc says:

      @shabeer_hassan
      //FIRST MY SON GO TO SCHOOL AGAIN & LEARN THE KNOWLEDGE//
      Yes, your son must go to a proper school and acquire knowledge instead of going to a madrasa.

      //HOW CAN A MAN UNDERSTAND FROM THE SENTENCE "Whoever takes up arms against us, is not from us" //
      It says exactly what I said here in CAPS is the part that specifically throws your theory out : "….takes up arms AGAINST US…..". Do you have a problem reading that? As I said you are a liar and a very poor one at that. In other words you are a Muslim :-).

      //THE TIME REACHED TO CHANGE HIS CORNEA/LENSES FROM HIS EYE OR SOMEONE TEACH HIM TO BASIC ENGLISH LANGUAGE//
      The above sentence is a conclusive proof of your English capabilities. With such poor English you should refrain from commenting on others' linguistic abilities.

      //The Prophet said, "None is killed unjustly, but the first son of Adam will have a part of its burden." Sufyan said//
      It also says exactly what I said. Killing polytheist is never unjust for a Muslim.

      General bloodshed isn't mentioned as a crime in the hadeeth you have mentioned which I quoted.
      //I ASKING U ONE QUESTION IS KILLING OWN SON WITH UNJUST IS BLOODSHED?//
      I said 'General Bloodshed' is not prohibited. The only thing said in the hadeeth is that don't kill your own son. It says nothing about other's son or daughter or polytheist killing. You can't deny history. Muslims killed, in fact butchered, thousands under Muhammad's direction. Here is a hadeeth supporting that. Lets see how you counter that:
      Shahi Bukhari
      Volume 4, Book 52, Number 256: Narrated As-Sab bin Jaththama: The Prophet passed by me at a place called Al-Abwa or Waddan, and was asked whether it was permissible to attack the pagan warriors at night with the probability of exposing their women and
      children to danger. The Prophet replied, "They (i.e. women and children) are from them (i.e. pagans)." I also heard the Prophet saying, "The institution of Hima is invalid except for Allah and His Apostle."

      //TAKE A NOTE BOOK WRITE THE FOLLOWING HADITH 1000000[EACH] TIME ,U EVER & NEVER SAYS ISLAM PROMOTING KILLING CHILDREN UP TO U'R DEATH//
      Don't put words in my mouth. I clearly said that THAT particular hadeeth says nothing about prohibitng daughters being killed. That hadeeth doesn't prohibit killing in general. It only asks you not to kill your sons.

      //Book 019, Hadith Number 4320 
      It is narrated by Ibn 'Umar that a woman was found killed in one of these battles; so the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) forbade the killing of women and children. //
      Why? Because women and children were being sold as slaves. Detesting their killing was a simple economic consideration. It is a fact that there was a good slave trade that was establishing as the Muslims were growing in power. I have proved it before in other threads. The fact that it was not out of any mercy for women and children is already proved by the hadeeth I have quoted above and I can quote a dozen of these all Shahi.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Ohhhh….its only about written words, here? 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Better attend majlis ta3lim :)

    • cchuckc says:

      @shabeer_hassan
      //Ohhhh….its only about written words, here? //
      Unfortunately I am not clairvoyant. Unwritten words are not read :-)

      //Better attend majlis ta3lim//
      Which harvests Islamic terrorists. Sorry I am not interested. If you want to counter the above and are not capable bring in your mullahs whose majlis-e-talim you attend. By the way, since you aren't able to counter doesn't it prove how insufficient your talim is?

    • ihateislam says:

      Chuck,
      Good. It proves beyond the shadow of a doubt how deficient their 'majlis ta3lim is or are.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      You sound like old friends :)

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Unfortunately :(

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Harvest? But we arent farmers. you are farmers who hide and burry seeds :)

    • shabeer_hassan says:

      ISLAM EVER SAY KEEP THE GIRLS ONLY :Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 320 
      (4) Not to kill your children[BOTH BOY/GIRL]
      Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 83 :: Hadith 37 
      do not act treacherously. Do not mutilate and do not kill children.
      Malik :: Book 21 : Hadith 21.3.11 
      slave forced sex prohibited:
      Dawud :: Book 12 : Hadith 2304 
      Bukhari:6949
      Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 79 :: Hadith 706
      Bukhari :: Book 8 :: Volume 77 :: Hadith 600
      Dawud :: Book 29 : Hadith 3952 
      Narrated AbuHurayrah: 
      The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The child of adultery is worst of the three. 
      WHO R KEEP THE GIRLS ONLY ?
      Numbers 31: 17-18
       
      17. Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
      18. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
       
      The Jewish soldiers were commanded by “God” in the bible to keep the woman children (little girls) for themselves! In addition, they commanded to kill every woman that hath know a man by lying with him. How these soldiers in those days know if the girls are virgin or not? Simply they verify it by raping them and if the Jews discovered that they are non-virgins then they kill them as they commanded by “God”.

      Numbers 31: 25-40
       
      25. And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
      26. Take the sum of the prey that was taken, both of man and of beast, thou, and Eleazar the priest, and the chief fathers of the congregation:
      27. And divide the prey into two parts; between them that took the war upon them, who went out to battle, and between all the congregation:
      28. And levy a tribute unto the LORD of the men of war which went out to battle: one soul of five hundred, both of the persons,(including the little girls) and of the beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep:
      29. Take it of their half, and give it unto Eleazar the priest, for an heave offering of the LORD.
      30. And of the children of Israel's half, thou shalt take one portion of fifty, of the persons(including the little girls), of the beeves, of the asses, and of the flocks, of all manner of beasts, and give them unto the Levites, which keep the charge of the tabernacle of the LORD.
      31. And Moses and Eleazar the priest did as the LORD commanded Moses.
      32. And the booty, being the rest of the prey which the men of war had caught, was six hundred thousand and seventy thousand and five thousand sheep,
      33. And threescore and twelve thousand beeves,
      34. And threescore and one thousand asses,
      35. And thirty and two thousand persons in all, of women that had not known man by lying with him.
      36. And the half, which was the portion of them that went out to war, was in number three hundred thousand and seven and thirty thousand and five hundred sheep:
      37. And the LORD'S tribute of the sheep was six hundred and threescore and fifteen.
      38. And the beeves were thirty and six thousand; of which the LORD'S tribute was threescore and twelve.
      39. And the asses were thirty thousand and five hundred; of which the LORD'S tribute was threescore and one.
      40. And the persons(including little girls) were sixteen thousand; of which the LORD'S tribute was thirty and two persons.(preteen girls)
       
      In the verse 35 we are told that Jews caught as booty 32.000 preteen girls for themselves.
       
       
      The verse 40 is to dedicate the little girls (of women that had not known man by lying with him-32 of them)
      to“God”! As God, himself commanded above that wants these preteen girls. Indeed clear perversion, God in the bible want for himself 32 little girls, why? Maybe to do what his soldiers(Jews)to the innocent little girls. Therefore Bible by saing that “LORD'S tribute was thirty and two persons.(preteen girls) actually demonstrate the Pedophilic nature of the biblical “God” . Shame to the Bible and Shame to its followers.
       
      So when we hear from the media, Priests(Christians and Jews-majority of Christians)  that rape and molest young preteen boys and girls, we must not be surprised because these are the teachings from their “Holy Book” the Bible, as clearly demonstrated from the Verses : Numbers 31: 25-40.
       

    • cchuckc says:

      @shabeer_hassan
      I have already shown hadeeths which go against what you are trying to prove. You haven't been able to counter them. If there are some good words, advice from Muhammad then that isn't surprising. He had to say a few good things for people to keep on believing him. But you can't fight with the facts that he killed people at time entire tribes were wiped off. Muslim armies invaded Persia, India, the Byzantines, and went all the way to Spain. They established one of the biggest slave trade that ever existed. And all of these are permissible under Islam.

      As far as bible is concerned this thread isn't about Bible so we need not comment on it.

  8. shabeer_hassan says:

    "But He fashioned him (man) in due proportion, and breathed into him something of His Spirit.  And He gave you (the faculties of) hearing and sight and feeling (and understanding): little thanks do ye give!   (The Noble Quran, 32:9)"
     The Prophet's Hadith is also found in Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 55, Number 549 and Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 593.
    &nbsp ;http://www.babycentre.co.uk/pregnancy/fetaldevelopment/18weeks/
    &nbsp ;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_fetal_development#development
    "When 42 nights have passed from the time of the nutfah (time of conception), Allah sends an angel to it, who shapes it and makes its ears, eyes, skin, muscles and bones…"  (Sahih Muslim, Kitab Al-Qadar)
    1.  Alaqah changing to mudghah.
    2.  Mudghah changing to izam.
    3.  Izam changing to lahm.
    The embryo at 24-25 days in the end of the alaqah stage, and it makes a direct change into the mudghah stage at 26-27 days.  The mudghah stage lasts until the 6th week, and then changes directly into the izam by the beginning of the 7th week, since the skeleton begins its appearance at that time.  The lahm stage follows in the 8th week immediately after the izam stage, since muscle precursor cells begin their development into muscle as soon as the bone is formed and the muscles can become attached.  Thus, the word fa is used in the Qur'an to accurately and strongly indicate that these developments follow on another immediately with no delay." (The Qur'an and Modern Science, Keith L. Moore, Abdul-Majeed A. Zindani, and Mustafa A. Ahmed, Pages 37-39, 46-47, ISBN 0-9627236-0-6)
    #1000 mistakes in the Quran…………..it was 100 times sinna repeat his claim ,i'm repeating my challenge ,plz bring the proof from the quran,prove here not  1000 ,at least "ONE" [only ONE enough],don't escape from the challenge……………………..
    #He raided villages and towns,…………butchered unarmed men and took as slaves their wives and children. He then sold those hapless captives and raped the prettier girls among them.  He told his followers to do the same…………………….
    Malik :: Book 21 : Hadith 21.3.10
     Do not kill women or children or an aged, weak person,Do not cut down fruit-bearing trees.Do not destroy an inhabited place. Do not slaughter sheep or camels except for food. Do not burn bees and do not scatter them. Do not steal from the booty, 
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 320 
    Not to join anything in worship along with Allah, (2) Not to steal, (3) Not to commit illegal sexual intercourse, (4) Not to kill your children, (5) Not to accuse an innocent person (to spread such an accusation among people), (6) Not to be disobedient (when ordered) to do good deeds. 
    #He raided villages and towns,…………butchered unarmed men and took as slaves their wives and children. He then sold those hapless captives and raped the prettier girls among them.  He told his followers to do the same…………………….
    Malik :: Book 21 : Hadith 21.3.10
     Do not kill women or children or an aged, weak person,Do not cut down fruit-bearing trees.Do not destroy an inhabited place. Do not slaughter sheep or camels except for food. Do not burn bees and do not scatter them. Do not steal from the booty, 
    Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 89 :: Hadith 320 
    Not to join anything in worship along with Allah, (2) Not to steal, (3) Not to commit illegal sexual intercourse, (4) Not to kill your children, (5) Not to accuse an innocent person (to spread such an accusation among people), (6) Not to be disobedient (when ordered) to do good deeds. 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Yeah..One, dont escape '.' 

    • cchuckc says:

      @Shabeer,
      //at least "ONE" [only ONE enough],don't escape from the challenge//
      I have already proved more than one. You have fled those discussions. Let me state one: Quran says that women are half as capable as men. In fact their inheritance is also half of that of a man and they also require double the number of witness. Do you think this is correct. We do find many women are far more capable than average men. In fact here on this very site a woman, @narcole, is trolling far better than any of you ever have including @zitouni and @amin.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Nah, im unstable when pms or period :) *makes you tea* 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Anyway, are you average man? do you like tea biscuits?

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721,
      //Nah, im unstable when pms or period//
      Which, even if true, is only 4-6 days in a month.

      //Anyway, are you average man?//
      Doesn't matter. 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Matter :) *feeds you from my hand* say aa 'o'

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Sometimes 10-14 days :)

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721
      //Sometimes 10-14 days//
      Only sometimes. Usually only around a week, and only between the age 12 to 50. So there are far more days when a woman isn't emotionally unstable(if we can say that) due to menstruation if we consider an average life of 70 years (and women on average live more years than men).

      Also I am not specifically talking about you. From your comments you seem unstable 30 days a month (and nights too).

    • sakat_1408_123 says:

      @ Chuck
      /Also I am not specifically talking about you. From your comments you seem unstable 30 days a month (and nights too)/.
      It seems you have diagnosed her perfectly.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Last month only 29 days '',

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Pms also unstable '.' How many days

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721
      //Pms also unstable '.' How many days//
      Why are you beating around the bush ? Oh sorry, thats your habit. So do you accept then that Quran correctly diagnoses women to be half as intelligent  and trustworthy as men are (and apparently because they are mentally unstable for a certain number of days)? Yes, No?

      By the way, lets just do the match. In average cases, a women bleeds between 12 and 50 and lives, say, till 70. So she is not emotionally OK for 32 years in her life. Now even when she menstruates, it is only for 4-5 days, and if she suffers from PMS its an additional 4-5 days, on average.. thats about 10 days in a month. SO of the remaining 38 years, that she has periods, the women is emotionally OK, or mentally stable as you term it, for 25 years. So we see that counting days a women is OK for 57 years out of an average of 70 years. And based on this your silly Allah gives farman that women should get half the inheritance, are half as trustworthy as witness etc. Masha Allah!!

    • cchuckc says:

      Corrections:
      //So she is not emotionally OK for 32 years in her life.//
      So she is not emotionally OK for 38 years in her life.

      //lets just do the match.//
      lets just do the math.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Inna lillahi

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Masha Allah! Allahu akbar! La ilaha illallah! 

    • sakat_1408_123 says:

      @Chuck
      /In fact here on this very site a woman, @narcole, is trolling far better than any of you ever have including @zitouni and @amin/.
      Really you are a cunning ha ha ha……………nice dissection.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Sakat did you help nizam at home when Eid? you are a good tolerating indian friend. Here, angpao.

    • sakat_1408_123 says:

      @Narcole
      I keep maximum distance from Muslims ,i have no interest in their rituals and Allah ,for me all these things look funny at this moment of 21st century ,when our knowledge is increasing in many fold .But to be frank Muslims are always illiterate and will be in future as well . Today i saw them doing that weird kind of sitting standing exercise in Unison ,i could not stop laughing for this madness .Just imagine how many productive human hours have been wasted in such way ,and how many death screaming of poor animal later that day,simply ridiculous wuff…..i can handle.

    • ihateislam says:

      Sakat,
      "I KEEP MAXIMUM DISTANCE FROM MUSLIMS–".
      That is a very wise decision.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Nah, you both keep folowing moslems ;)

    • ihateislam says:

      IMPOSSIBLE. They have nothing to offer. Why should I waste my time following them? Rather, they follow us. Your appearance on this site is proof of that.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      See you are following my posts :)

    • Nizamuddin Sheikh says:

      Dear Sister Narcole,

      If I'll celebrate Eid then he will help me but I've decided to do not celebrate a festival that is based on false.  I'll celebrate "Nauroz" dated on 05-July of every year and 14- July as "Roz-e-Azadi" but this Eid is like for all thinkers a salvation day. because A person who can't think he is a foolish, and a person who deny to think he is a biased, and who is  not able to think a slave. so you can decide in which category Muhammad put all true Muslims.   

    • shabeer_hassan says:

      U NOTHING PROVED HERE [PLZ READ AGAIN  FROM THE POST "exoitm real …….." 'U'R CLAIM WAS why different type of materiel water,soil,blood,for  human creation i ANSWERED .there r two types of creation acc islam first adam[a] ,almighty god used [water,soil]……………then rest of the human from them [blood,sperm,etc.]…..
      next he jumped to Quran says that # women are half as capable as men……………..
      “Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because
      Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because
      they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women
      are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband’s) absence what
      Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye
      fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to
      share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly), but if they return to
      obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance): for Allah is
      Most High, Great (above you all).” (H.Q. 4:34)
      “Divorced women shall wait concerning for three monthly
      periods. And it is not lawful for them to hide what Allah hath created
      in their wombs, if they have faith in Allah and the Last Day. And their
      husbands have the better right to take them back in that period, if they
      wish for reconciliation. And women shall have rights similar to the
      rights against them, according to what is equitable; but men have a
      degree over them and Allah is Exalted in Power.” (H.Q. 2:228)
      These have been the verses quoted by those who accuse the
      Qur'an of being influenced by male chauvinism. It is claimed that these
      verses make it clear that the Qur'an has been a product of the malechauvinistic
      tendencies of the Arabs. What, then, is the reality?
      In the first verse quoted above, the Qur'an says that man is
      Qawwam over woman. In Arabic the word Qawwam or Qayyim
      refers to the one who looks after the affairs of a person or an enterprize
      and supervises over their necessary requirements. Indeed, it implies
      more of a responsibility than an obligation. The said verse then
      summarises that the control over the institution of the family which
      includes, the affairs of woman and children or the responsibility for
      their well-being dwells upon man.
      The family is an institution. It is a noble institution that grants
      peace and tranquility to both halves of the soul. In fact, it is the family
      that forms the most important of all social institutions. It will by
      acknowledged by all that any institution will require an able head for
      its growth, development and the resolution of its various problems. To
      any versed even in the most basic lessons of management, it is common
      knowledge that any firm, no matter howsoever good its credentials, is
      bound to wither away in the absence of a controlling head of affairs.
      Then is there not the necessity of a head for the family wherein the
      very foundation of all morality in society is being formulated? It is
      indeed, vital that there must be an overseer for properly carrying out
      all the incumbent responsibilities that arise while maintaining a family
      right from bringing up childrenand giving them all the guidance required
      for making them responsible members of the society. Otherwise, total
      anarchy and chaos will be the result.
      It is clear, therefore, that there must be a person to assume the
      leadership of the family. It would be more correct to search for the
      one who is really more capable for this than to ask the question as to
      who is more deserving. It should either be that both assume the
      leadership jointly or that the woman assume the leadership of the family
      herself. Let us approach the problem from the unprejudiced, basic
      premise that the man is to be entrusted with that responsibility only if
      both these options are impracticable.
      It is more dangerous for an institution to have two leaders than
      for it to be without any. It is commonplace for the very institution
      themselves to fall apart in all the cases wherein the enterprise, previously
      handled by the father before his death, is not justly approportioned off
      or is not passed on to any one of his children for its proper functioning.
      In institutions where there exists more than one leader, the institution
      is wrecked by the power tussle and other problems related to leadership.
      Even if it does not fall apart, the ‘products’ that come forth will be
      defective in some way. So is the case with the family. If both are
      made the leaders, there will be a dichotomy of views concerning their
      approaches to the resolution of problems. This will result in a jostling
      for power and leadership. This will then, in turn, result in a disturbance
      family atmosphere. Children brought up in such a family atmosphere
      will become subject to mental tensions and imbalances. This will then
      be the cause of the moral laxity of the next generation.
      Can a woman really assume control of the family? Or is that
      responsibility to be entrusted to man? The answer to this question lies
      in the counter question. ‘Is it intellect or emotion that is necessary to
      control the family?’ If it is intellect, then the control of the family is to
      be entrusted to man, if emotions, then to woman.

    • cchuckc says:

      @shabeer_hassan
      //U NOTHING PROVED HERE [PLZ READ AGAIN  FROM THE POST "exoitm real …….." 'U'R CLAIM WAS why different type of materiel water,soil,blood,for  human creation i ANSWERED .there r two types of creation acc islam first adam[a] ,almighty god used [water,soil]……………then rest of the human from them [blood,sperm,etc.].//
      Go back and read that thread. You were saying something about tea being made of sugar etc. The illogical statements you were making were seen by all and sundry.

      Here I am pointing yet another inaccuracy from Quran. Fact is Quran says that women earn half the inheritance compared to men and double the witnesses compared to men. Do you deny that? Narcole posits that women lack mental balance and that is the reason we have these provisions in Islam. Do you agree or you don't? I have already proved by actually counting average number of such days that it still accounts for 21 years in a woman who lives for 70 years, say. Narcole couldn't counter that, you may try, instead of bringing in more Islamic garbage.

    • shabeer_hassan says:

      One: The Qur'an recognizes the right of woman to earn wealth.
      Indeed, to earn as much as she desires. There is to be no right for the
      man in any such earnings of hers. Her earnings will be hers alone.
      Two: Under no circumstances will the protection and maintenance
      of woman; children or the parents become the duty of the
      woman. This then means that irrespective of how wealthy a woman
      might be, she is not duty bound to bear the expenses of her own self,
      children, parents or husband.
      Three: Woman has the right to take, at the time of her marriage,
      her dower from her husband. This dower (Mehr) is then effectively
      treated as her own wealth.
      Four: The protection of the family is the duty of man. It is man
      who is duty bound to bear the expenses of his wife and children. Furthermore,
      it is again his duty to protect his parents and other close
      relatives. In effect, therefore, all financial burdens have to be borne
      by man.
      Five: Irrespective of how wealthy a wife might be, the husband
      has no right, whatsoever, to take from any portion of her wealth without
      her explicit permission.
      The question may now be considered as to whether the Qur'an
      has dealt justly or discriminatingly with the woman.
      The wealth of inheritance received by woman is hers and hers
      alone. None else has the right to this wealth. But what of that received
      by man? He has to pay his marriage dower, take up the maintenance
      of the women. And to bear her as well as the children’s expenses.
      All falls under the responsibility of the man. Then is it man or
      woman who has found favourable treatment in the Qur'an?
      All other religious texts, which confer financial responsibilities
      upon the man, have, in lieu of such duties, restricted the right to inheritance
      with the man. As for the Qur'an, while it does stress upon the
      fact that all financial burdens will be shouldered by man, it, nevertheless,
      provides for the inheritance of woman as well. Indeed, by
      approportioning half the inheritance of man to woman it has greatly
      honoured her.
      What then, can be the non-Qur'anic recommendations of the
      critics on this subject? Two such recommendations may be raised:
      1. Woman be given twice the wealth of man. Confer financial responsibilities upon woman.
      2. Man and woman be given equal share in the wealth of inheritance.
      Distribute financial responsibilities equally between them.
      Both these recommendations seek to burden woman with the
      yoke of financial responsibilities. This is an idea that is against the
      very nature of womanhood. For, during times of pregnancy and childbirth
      she yearns for the care and protection of the man. To burden
      woman with financial responsibilities, as a rule, is to create conditions
      of grave and far reaching consequences that will arise in the future.
      As such, it is certain that the law which the Qur'an has put forward as
      the subject of inheritance is, by far, the best that there is for woman’s
      good.

    • Ali Sina says:

      @ Shabeer-Hasan
      You are flooding the site with irrelevant copy pastes. Pleas just engage in dialogue. If people want to read Mualim articles they will go to Muslim sites.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Oh im moslem, and im on this site. i went here from typing islam on google. 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      What is this site about then? A diary of atheist? Why not put that title? hm…such title could sound attractive for movie too

    • shabeer_hassan says:

      @ali sinna

      I AM ANSWERING U'R MEMBERS QUESTION ,I AM NOT INCLUDING LONG ISLAMIC TEACHING OR MY PERSONAL COMMENTS OR I AM NOT POSTING THE IRRELEVANT COMMENTS HERE …………. A POSITIVE WAY OF DEBATE IS PART OF LEARNING TRUTH,EVERY MAN HAS TO RIGHT TO EXPRESS HIS VIEWS /CLAIM………SOME TIME A LONG POST REQUIRED FOR UNDERSTANDING A TOPICS,WE R DISCUSSING HERE RELIGION /CIVILIZATION ,FROM TWO OR THREE LINE WE CAN'T ANSWER THEIR CLAIM ,A ANSWER IS COMPLETED, IT MUST INCLUDE VERSES EVIDENCE,HOW TO PRACTICABLE IN HUMAN LIFE,HOW PROPHET HIS SAHABHA UNDERSTAND/LEARN THAT VERSES /TOPIC ,ETC………………… 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Ali, in case you're *coughs* unable to be here anymore, who will maintain this site? i dont mind to volunteer as admin. free. lillahi ta3ala :)

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Subhanallah…so fair…:')

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721
      //Subhanallah…so fair//
      In shabeer's language , Subah = morning and nallah = sewer drain. :-)… So Subhanallah can imply a sewer drain (visited in the) morning.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Thanks for showing us your linguistic intelligence. :) 

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721,
      //Thanks for showing us your linguistic intelligence.//
      You are welcome.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Whoah…he just welcomed a moslem. Nice :') hidayah…i led him to 'behave'..alhamdu lillaah…….♥

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721
      //Whoah…he just welcomed a moslem. //
      So? Thats the courtesy part. May be new to you.

      //.i led him to 'behave'.//
      I have always behaved well. But, alas, I can't say the same about  you. La haula wa la quwwata.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      La haula wa la quwwata illa billah

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721
      //La haula wa la quwwata illa billah//
      There was a reason I quoted the first part. It has its own significance :-).

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Not always :/

    • shabeer_hassan says:

      #women earn half the inheritance compared to men ……………………and double the witnesses compared to men…………………………………….

      YESTERDAY I POSTED REPLAY FOR U ALI SINNA DELETE IT,BEC'S THE FEAR OF MASS PEOPLE CONVERSION TO ISLAM ,HE SAYS TO ME THIS IS NOT THE PLACE FOR SPREADING TRUTH,SO MY BROTHER ,I WILL GIVE U LINK WHAT IS THE ISLAMIC STAND REGARDING U'R CLAIM,FIRST U READ IT CAREFULLY ,THEN POST U'R SUGGESTION BASED ON IT…………………..
      http://womenislamf.blogspot.in/

    • cchuckc says:

      @shabeer_hassan
      What the link you have provided doesn't answer the questions it itself sets out to prove. I will quote some truths that the article talks about:
      1. However, it does reject the idea of the equality of the sexes as well. In its view, it is impossible that man be equivalent to woman or that woman be the equal to man. 
      2. Q2:28, last part "but men have a degree over them and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise."
      So the article quotes this and then doesn't explain what the last part here :-)
      3. The article says that the position of women then was very weak because apparently the Romans thought so and so about them. First the Arabs were not Romans. Second Khadija was a rich business women which shows that in that society women actually were relatively free and used to run businesses. Third, even among Romans we find politically powerful women, so the allegations against the Romans isn't really true. Fourth, if this is really about the condition of women at that time, don't you think then that these rulings are invalid now, at least in most societies? And if that is so, don't you think Quran requires rewriting?
      4. "The Qur'an has given the woman, like the man, the right to earn wealth."
      See the comment about Khadija again. 

      I stop here, not because I can't go further, but because I have showed a sample of how that article could be shredded to pieces.
      Lets go back to the comment that I had posted. Do you deny that women are provided half the inheritance and their witness is counted as half. Yes, No? Also do you think the reason Narcole gives for this is correct? Yes, No. Instead of answering straight questions with direct answers you are just propagating Islamic apologies.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      How about you meet prophet and ask him directly? ",

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721
      //How about you meet prophet and ask him directly? //
      I won't meet that dacoit that I am pretty sure. But since you couldn't answer can I assume that you don't know the answer and your majlis-e-talim, that you advertise with so much vigour, hasn't been able to impart you enough 'knowledge'?

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Hm? answer what? did you say something? ._. 

    • cchuckc says:

      @narcole1919721
      //Hm? answer what? did you say something? //
      :-). Just go through the whole thread.

    • narcole1919721 says:

      When should i go? 

    • narcole1919721 says:

      Im sure you could meet him. do shalawat thousands times without hadats and najs :)

    • ihateislam says:

      Only necromancers talk to skeletons.

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